Fascism isn’t New to America: A Conversation with Joseph Kelly
Summary
Host Leigh McGowan interviews historian Joseph Kelly about his new book, *The Biggest Lie*, which argues that fascism is an American invention rooted in antebellum white supremacy rather than a European import. Kelly traces how elite Southern plantation owners established a culture of lying and exclusion to protect slavery, creating a "master race democracy" that persists today. The discussion connects these historical tactics to modern political strategies, including voter suppression, disinformation, and the erosion of civil rights under the current administration.
Topics discussed
Introduction: Democracy under threat and guest Joseph Kelly
The prehistory of American fascism and the 'Big Lie'
Founding compromises, slavery, and the Declaration of Independence
Rewriting history: From the New Deal narrative to Trump's regime
The Missouri Compromise and the rejection of equality
Sponsors: 3-Day Blinds and OneSkin
Plessy v. Ferguson and the legal basis for segregation
Herrenvolk democracy and the shrinking 'in-group'
Disinformation, Christian nationalism, and the Texas election
Reconstruction, the Civil War Amendments, and the 17th Amendment
Sponsor: Cheers Restore
Sponsor: Quince
The rise of ICE and the militarization of law enforcement
The biggest lie: Hierarchy vs. Equality
Grassroots organizing and state-level political strategy
Conclusion: The battle for America's identity
Outro and support for the podcast
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